Sunday, September 23, 2007

Catcher in the Rye 3: Coming of Age


In examining The Catcher in the Rye, we also need to carefully look at the idea of a coming-of-age novel.
Coming-of-age novels are often about characters who searching for his/her own identity and place in the world. The Catcher in the Rye deals directly with Holden's struggle to find himself and define himself in the world.

With this understanding, address the following:

1) What is Holden searching for? How does Holden define and/or differeniate himself?
2) What symbols, scenes, minor characters, etc. help inform you about his search?
3) Evaluate his search. (Is he forming a healthy identity? Is his search for self foolish or invaluable?)


Second Part - Read the two selected chapters from Chris Lynch's Inexcusable. Discuss the use of point of view in the text in relation to how the narrator defines himself. What connections, if any, can you make to The Catcher in the Rye in terms of point of view, self-definition, style, etc.?

Feel free to comment on anything you want. My questions are only your guides.

Good luck!!!! I am excited for your responses!

49 comments:

Ngoc D. 4 said...

As Mr. Walsh said, the Catcher in the Rye is a coming-of-age novel. This far in the story, I think that Holden is looking for a place where he belongs, his “home” like in the song Homeward Bound, and maybe he’s also looking for his identity. Like he said, Allie and Phoebe are smart and both have red hair. Even though he comes from the same family, he does not identify himself as smart and he doesn’t have red hair. Holden is feeling excluded from the family. The way he describes it, his dad is a wealthy lawyer and his mom is this elegant, rich class lady. Holden is just this kid who flunks out of four schools and have gray hair. The red hunting hat that Holden bought speaks a great deal about Holden. The fact that it is red shows that he wants to be like his brother and sister, who have red hair. He wants to belong in the family, who have red hair and do better in school than he does. Also, he told Mr. Spencer that the hat is a “people shooting hat”, like we discussed in class, he is not literally “shooting” people with bullets. It is a “judgment hat”, a hat that he puts on to call people “morons”, “prostitute”, “phony,” and etc. Also, the ducks, ah, yes, the mysterious ducks that disappear in the winter. The fact that Holden asks about the duck is a mystery in itself. I was very surprise when Holden asks the taxi drivers about the ducks. It proves that Holden is not always a jerk that calls everyone “phony”; that he is still has a curiosity, almost like a kid. I think the ducks represent Allie because both of them disappear and that Holden have an interest in them. Also, he mentions the half frozen pond; I think that goes perfectly with the theme coming-of-age. In class, Lynn talks about how it is half frozen and half solid is a metaphor for how Holden is half a child and half an adult. I think by the end of the book, when we get more into the winter, the pond will be completely frozen, marking the end of the book and the journey that Holden went through to become of age. However, right now, he’s not making any progress at all about finding himself. Holden is drinking and pulling an all-nighter, and hiring a prostitute.

In the excerpts from “Inexcusable” by Chris Lynch, the narrator used the point of view to show the readers of his innocent. In the first person I, Keir makes himself look like a guy with no guilt or falsenesses. However, when he switches to the third person limited, he turned into a monster, laughing his soccer teammate’s embarrassment and pain. Even though he is not doing the right thing by suffocating Gigi, he does it anyways and says that “the way it looks is not the way it is.” If it was another person looking in, they would say otherwise. Because of the point of view, Keir introduces himself as a nice guy that he thinks he is and convinced the readers that also. Yet, when he watch the video of the football players torturing the soccer player, he introduces himself as “he”, the person who is “acting like a football player” the people who did those awful things to the soccer players. Keir doesn’t accept this monster on the screen, it’s “he” who did it, not “me.” He keeps saying that he is “not one of those pissing football players,” but he is. However, he lessen the level of monstrosity by using the third person.

I apologize for the really really really long entry. Please don't hate me. >.<'

Mr. Walsh said...

Ngoc, don't aplogize for a long entry. Really nice point on both texts. I wish I was in class today when you discussed the pond's frozenness. :(


Reminder to all, let us respond to one another and avoid sarcasm.

Jeniffer M 2 said...

Holden is such a confusing character. I'm constantly changing my opinion about him. He seems like a very lost kid. I think he might be searching for a way out of something, like the ducks in the pond. I think Salinger tries to differentiate Holden by making him view other people as phonies, making Holden appear like he's the only "real" person around. The three girls at the club really show this because he talks about the movie stars and how they swoon over them and they very gullible and ignorant. I also think Holden is searching for respect. I believe he feels like he wants to be taken seriously and there's a certain prejudice against teens and young adults, that they're all unintelligent and like to talk about movie stars and stupid things like that. I thought it was kind of ironic how Holden was more mature than the woman and they were actually older than Holden.

I think the story, Inexcusable, was a great example of how you can't really trust what the author tells you because he/she can write anything and the reader will believe it. So, I really liked the story because of that, the sense of being able to change a reader's opinion with the choice of my words or the way I position them.

Trang T 2 said...

As in the beginning of the story, Holden is introduced as a guy who has a psychological disorder. He has to face with nervous breakdown after his brother, Allie had passed away. Allie was the one who was there for him and protected him. Society and people around him tell him that this is the time to change. Despite his limited experiences about life, for me, Holden seems like his attitude toward women is mature and respectable. He doesn’t only struggle within himself; he also has to struggle with his family and his friendships. He said to himself he is the dump one in the family while his father is a lawyer who has lots of dough. His brother, DB, is a writer in Hollywood. His sister, Phoebe, is a genius.
And this novel represents as a coming age story. With the pattern of flowing events, he first begins in emotional turmoil, struggle himself and people around him to find out who he is what he is looking for in life, and eventually suffers from emotional and physical collapse. I found this novel Catcher in the rye is very meaningful. After he goes through all of this, he wants to be someplace where he really fits in. I haven’t finished the story yet, but what I guess is that he wants to find a job where he doesn’t necessary have to communicate to people much through the fact he isn’t a good communicated person. And I also think Holden will leave New York where he thinks New Yorkers are phonies and for them money really talks.

Mr. Walsh said...

Do not confuse the author with the narrator, when looking at 1st person texts or all texts for that matter.

Chloe C 2 said...

I get the feeling that Holden is looking for an escape. He doesn’t want to be in a world full of phonies, never mind that he is one himself. Holden envies the ducks in the pond. They can fly away from their cold home to a warmer place. But he can’t. Holden’s stuck in a cold world, just like the frozen fish. But unlike the other frozen fish, Holden is a *smart* fish. He knows the pond is frozen. All Holden can do is find a melted part of the pond and try not to bump into any ice. Although the world is cold, there are some happy moments where people are not phony that makes living more bearable. The thing to do is not to run away from society, but to live in it as best you can while looking at the good points in life.
“Inexcusable” by Chris Lynch is written in the first person, like “The Catcher in the Rye”, so it is unreliable. I see a loss of innocence in the story. In the beginning, Keir sounds like a model student. In an awkward position, yes, but by his actions and words we know Kier is shy, reserved, and not quick to anger. But as the story progresses, that innocence is gone. He looks forward to others’ misfortune. He thinks lowly of the soccer team even though he was dubbed an honorary member. He’s violent (wants to kill the guy behind the camera). He’s watching the tape in “a room full of guys and beer and noise, laughing and clapping” Tsk tsk. Growing up does not seem like a happy future. With all the depressing stories about how heartless, selfish and prideful people get, plus the whole image concept, staying a kid sounds good right now.
PS. Ngoc, thanks for being the first to post. Brave soul.

Mr. Walsh said...

Just remember: Inexcusable is not a short story, but rather two chapters from a larger work. You are missing some things. Don't let that bog you down.

Trang T 2 said...

First when I started to read ‘’ Inexcusable’’ by Chris Lynch. I got very confused. I thought that my pages weren’t in order at all. I was about to ask Mr. Walsh if it was. But right at the beginning of the story, I realize that it starts out the end of the story. Keir (the main character) is arguing with the girl, Gigi. Then after that, the author tries to bring us back with Keir’s memories when he was in high school. As I read along the story, Keir was in soccer team. And by accidentally, he had some kind of argues with some guy in a football team. They had drinking party and they were fooling around... I think this is a wrong thing for them to do because they were in high school and they weren’t old enough for drinking alcohol. I’m wondering that what Keir and Gigi argue about. He said he loves Gigi and she was calling him a bastard. Is anyone helping me to bring this up?

Lynn T. 4 said...

Holden is walking around New York and he is close to being broke but he still does not go home. I think he is looking for something, but what? I agree with Ngoc that Holden wants to find his home. For example, I think every time Holden asks where the ducks are going to go when winter comes, he is asking where will he go. How is he going to escape the harshness of the world? How is he going to escape the phoniness? He is looking for his safety.
Like Trang, I was also confused by the page numbers. However I realized that it is like “The Catcher in the Rye”, the story is backwards, and it is leading up to one event. When I read “Inexcusable” by Chris Lynch, I saw similar traits in Keir Sarafian that I saw in Holden. For example, they both contradict themselves a lot. On page 48, when he is talking about the broken Paul Revere Statue he says “we didn’t mean to do this.” You get the impression that they did break it, but it was an accident. Then immediately after he says “I would remember if we toppled the whole statue over,” which sounds like he is saying he had absolutely nothing to do with it. However it is up to us to decide what is true or not. Like “The Catcher in the Rye” it is in first person, so Keir is also unreliable and it is hard to differentiate a lie form the truth. He also denies pulling the prank on the soccer team, and whatever he did to Gigi. The very first sentence he says, “The way it looks is not the way it is.” What is he doing that looks wrong? In this scene, he is alone with Gigi, and she is screaming. He says “Good guys understand that no means no, and so I could not have done this because I understand, and I love Gigi Boudakian.” When he said he understand no, it reminded me of today’s class discussion when someone said Holden knew when a girl said no unlike Stradlater. In this case, I think Keir is like Stradlater, I think he is date-raping Gigi. It says “I am terrified by it and read out, lunge toward her and try and cover her mouth with my hands and I fall over her and she screams louder…” He is basically on top of her trying to conceal something. He is probably afraid that someone might hear her, and see what he is doing. He tries to hard to prove that he is innocent. If Keir did not really do anything bad, then why he trying so hard to prove himself?

Mr. Walsh said...

Everyone - nice job referring back to the text!!!

Trang T 2 said...

Thanks for your response, Lynn. I agree with you that the story is unreliable told by 1st person. I think his father is an alcoholic and he is the main reason why Keir gets bad influences from him. Keir begins his father’s footsteps to use alcohol and drugs. He got a nickname ‘’ Killer’’ in football because he tackled some of the guy in the opposing team so hard that he couldn’t get up. Keir keeps saying he is a good guy but for me he tries not to accept any responsibilities. And yet, I can see the connection between Catcher in the rye’’ and Inexcusable. The narrator is the 1st person and because of that, the narrator tries to convince the readers about what they think. They both talk about how teenagers struggle through their life becoming a young adult. Holden has to face with phonies around him and Keir couldn’t control himself through binge drinking party and ends up with bad outcome.

Mr. Walsh said...

Lynn, nice job in bringing up class discussion.

Many of you are discussing the issue of unreliability in Catcher.

What scenes don't we trust? Why? How does that make you feel?

Marissa G 4 said...

Holden is searching for companionship and acceptance. Throughout the novel whenever he is alone he goes out ,calls someone, or asks his cab driver if he wants to get a drink. Form the start of the novel we are driven to think that Holden is a loner when in my opinion he is the opposite. Holden defines himself as a recluse, as the reader we see him as a loner in the beginning, then we see him as someone that just wants to have friends. The red hunting hat that he buys is to make himself pit in with his family, everyone in his family has red hair except Holden who has brown and grey hair. The red at when he puts it on gives him the idea that he better belongs within his family. With Ackley who Holden describes as sort of a loser, then he goes and hangs out with him all the time and talkies to him. Holden also puts his opinion of sex very out there. He thinks random hook ups are not good and he seems to be waiting for the right girl (Jane) to lose his virginity also losing his virginity would sort of be a way to make him become mature which he doesn’t want to be, which we have discussed as a class when Mr. Walsh was not there. I think Holden is forming a healthy identity, he is finding himself thought the book and when we are done with the novel the Holden we met at the football game will be different then the Holden that we will end with.

First of I wan to say that I really liked the 2 chapters form Inexcusable. The point of view of the story is in 1st person just like The Catcher in the Rye is. We are hearing the story from the point of view of a boy that is telling us about his story. The boy in the story was on the soccer team used to play football and still doesn’t no who he is. He won’t call himself a soccer player and he won’t call himself a football player so he stuck trying to figure out what he is and who he is just like Holden is doing.

sandy j 2 said...

I agree with Ngoc when he said that Holden is searching for his identity. The way he does though is not productive or smart. I think Holden does want to be different from other people. He wants his own identity that’s unique and that’s like nobody else’s because he thinks that mostly everyone is phony. He’s already different from people his age because of his gray hair. He’s only a teen but yet he has gray hair. His family’s rich and everyone has something going for them but he has nothing. For Allie it was baseball, for Phoebe it’s writing and just being smart and his brother D.B is in Hollywood. Holden doesn’t want to act like people from his social class because he feels like he doesn’t belong. He’s angry because of that so he tries to be someone else, do different things and he insults everyone by calling them phonies. I think that’s just his way of getting back at the people who he’s different from because he really can’t do anything else. Also Holden’s need to be different makes him immature. He’s like an angry little kid who acts out and does everything different from everybody else. Holden does any little thing he can to be different. One example is his red hat. Usually people wear their hats normal, but him he wears it backwards. He gives his hat a new meaning “Hunting hat”, just so the hat itself can represent him, so it can represent his alienation from everybody else.



In the chapters of “Inexcusable”, Keir views himself different from what other people see. He considers himself the good guy, but his actions said differently. That’s why at the end of page three, he said “The way it looks is not the way it is.” ‘Say what you did, Keir. Admit what you did to me.’ ‘I didn’t do anything Gigi.’ I don’t know the whole story of inexcusable, but from the evidence I can see that keir is denying something he did and that thing was wrong. Later in the story, he tries to convince himself that he is a good guy and that he does nothing wrong. The title of the story helps understanding it because whatever keir is doing wrong, they’re inexcusable and they happen in more than one situation, more than once in the story. I think the author of inexcusable is trying to create three different points of views; the way the reader sees keir, the way he sees himself and the way the characters in the book see him. It’s a great concept because it’s like we’re judging the character. It also makes reading it more interesting and it puts a twist in the story. It plays with your mind to see the different kind of writing styles of different authors.

Hillary D 2 said...

After I thought about Holden, I don’t think he’s looking for perfection. I think he may be looking for a place with no phonies. What I mean is…a place with no adults. When Stradlater would go on all those dates and have sex with most of them, Holden thinks that is an adult matter. He thinks that it’s okay to know about sex, but it isn’t okay to do it when you barely know the person (the reason why he got so worked up about Stradlater with Jane). I think he thinks the world is so influenced by adult behavior and he wants to stay innocent. Even so, he’s still curious about the matters, but doesn’t fully give in (when he rejected the prostitute). I don’t think he’s forming a healthy identity because he criticizes everyone and alienates himself from the world. He pulls back from what he thinks is too phony and adult-mattered.

The narrator in Inexcusable is saying how good of a person he is. I get the sense he’s telling us he never did anything wrong. “I am a good guy. Good guys don’t do bad things.” He doesn’t like conflict and just wants to move on with everything, he doesn’t like the discuss problems. He says, “And I don’t feel guilty. That is, I don’t feel like I am guilty. But I sure as hell feel sorry.” And later on he says, “The way it looks is not the way it is.” I think he does do things wrong, but he means well such as when a mother scolds her child. I think Keir connects to Holden because they don’t really know who they really are on the inside. Holden feels alone and different from the rest and is not very reliable. He doesn’t really care about other peoples problems like Keir when he tackled the guy playing football.

Consuelo T 2 said...

I think Holden is searching for acceptance or a feeling of belonging somewhere. He feels he doesn�t belong in his family, his father makes a lot of money, and his brother is a writer, and he keeps getting kicked out of school. Also how Phoebe, and Allie are so smart, and how they have red hair, and he has gray hair. So he wears the red hat so he can belong. I also think Holden wants to go �home�. The ducks are also important symbolism. The two times Holden gets in the cab he starts the same conversation with them. He brings up the ducks and ask where they go. I think he�s sort of asking �where do I go�. He also doesn�t seem to want to grow up. He seems to be very curious about sex, but is still a virgin. He talks about it without even having it. I think he doesn�t want to grow up, and losing your virginity something that happens when you do. I think he doesn�t want to grow up because he doesn�t want to be a phony. He doesn�t want to be in that world, full of phony grown ups. I also thought it was interesting when Phoebe asked Holden one thing he liked and he said Allie. I think he said he like Allie because he�s his brother obviously but also maybe because Allie never got to grow up. He�s never going to have to grow up, and maybe that�s the reason why Holden doesn�t want to either. I found the chapters of �Inexcusable� interesting. It is in first person like �The Catcher in the Rye�. What did he do to Gigi? What did Kier do that was so bad? Or maybe what he did was bad since the source is not reliable, and we don�t really hear it from Gigi. Kier is defending himself throughout the story. However if he said he didn�t do anything wrong then why is he trying so hard to prove the reader that. I also found that my opinions of the character changes, like it did for Holden.

Katherine Z 4 said...

I agree with Hillary that Holden is searching for a place where there’s no adult, a place where it’s full of children. Like how he mistaken the lyrics “If a body meet a body coming through the rye with “If a body catch a body coming through the rye.” Holden’s ideal world would be a world where thousands of children are in the rye, with no adults in it, except Holden, while Holden is standing on some crazy cliff. He wants to catch anybody that might fall down the cliff; he made himself to be like a protector of the children in the rye. It can be seen like a metaphor, Holden wants to protect the children from the dangerous fall, Holden wants to protect the children from the dangerous world of adults. From what we read so far, Holden’s view of adult world is all full of negative views, it’s a world full of phonies. Holden doesn’t want the innocent children to experience the harshness of the adult world, he want them to remain as they are, pure and innocent. He wants to be the protector of the children, the one who will protect them from any negative experience.

I agree with Lynn when she said that in the beginning Keir had raped Gigi. The conversation between Keir and Gigi when he said “I didn’t go anything Gigi.” “Yes you did! I said no.” I kind of have a picture in my mind where Keir is drunk and forcing himself on Gigi who obviously didn’t want to do it. I wonder where they were when this happen, if she argued with Keir, she would shout and someone will obviously hear her, but no one seems to know. In this story in the beginning its all in 1st person, we only hear about what Keir thinks about, he will definitely defend himself, making the reader believe that he’s not at fault, even if he did rape Gigi, he will not admit it. Keir mentions how everyone thinks him to be the perfect guy, a nice, polite guy who would never do anything bad. However, when the story shifts into third guy limited, we begin to see Keir from a different point of view. We see that actually he’s not as nice as he makes us believe, he’s a guy who “shove their heads under the water for a long time.” Keir is actually the kind of football player who picks on other who’s weaker then himself.

Jessica F 2 said...

I think Holden is searching for something real to him. Everything to him is phony but when he’s with Phoebe and when Allie was alive it was real to him. He doesn’t want to grow up either because growing up and becoming an adult you have to deal with a lot more then when you’re a child. Holden wants to leave to find something real. The ducks help realize that. He always talks about where the ducks go for winter and they symbolize how he wants to leave and find a new place to go. Phoebe and Allie symbolize the only people Holden thinks his real, in a way they are his security, the only place he feels he belongs. I thin everybody is looking for something real in their life but not the type of real that Holden is out to get. Normal people have different views on the world. Well lets face it, anyone telling a story from a mental institution clearly isn’t the most normal person in the world.



I agree with Jennifer m, in her point about Inexcusable. She said that the author can write anything and the reader will believe it and that in the story the author changed your opinion on the main character. Anything that the author has the narrator say is really believable to any reader. The point of view in the 2 chapters is in first person and then switches to third person limited.

Mr. Walsh said...

Consuelo, interesting point about how Allie never grew up. I think this is worth exploring (paper topic?).

Many of you are right on in your analysis of Keir in Inexcusable.


I want to go back to the post: Evaluate Holden's search.

Also from period 2 today, is Holden crazy? (Come on, let's debate this!!!!!!!)

Elaine T 4 said...

Holden is constantly searching for himself and a place in life where he belongs. Holden searches for people who understand him and don't judge him like his little sister Phoebe. I know Holden is constantly searching for a place where he can just be himself because every time he gets to a new destination, he's never satisfied and is always moving around. Holden's never been able to stay at one school for a long time nor is he able to stay in one destination like New York for a while too. Moreover, Holden's always surrounding himself with different people. One minute he's with Sally then Luce and then some prostitute who's a total stranger. Holden's searching for a place where he can be himself and searching for people that can accept him for him and not judge him. Also, Holden differentiates himself from others with his sarcasms and remarks about others. Holden doesn't like people who judge him yet he judges everyone and this is one of the first things many readers and characters can see about Holden; he's a hypocrite. Also Holden wears his red hunting hat to differentiate his feelings of wanting to fit into his family and in the world.

A symbol that could inform me about Holden's constant search for acceptance would be the ducks he keeps mentioning. These ducks migrate and move from place to place just like Holden does and Holden is constantly searching for them. Each time Holden is close to getting some acceptance, the quest is prolonged just like each time Holden is close to finding the answer to the ducks, they migrate again. Also, Holden's constant search for the ducks is like his constant search for acceptance and a home. Also Holden's search is a good thing. By finding a place and people who he can be himself with and be comfortable with, Holden would slowly be able to let go of the past and be able to grasp the concept that life goes on whether he wants it to or not. And by him finding acceptance, maybe he'd be able to accept who he is as a person and love himself.


When I first read the 2 chapters of Inexcusable, I noticed that the point of view was in 1st person just like Cather in the Rye. Also the boy in the story was on the soccer team and the football team but he doesn’t really know where he belongs or recognizes himself as a football player or soccer player; he's caught in between and is indecisive and doesn’t know who he is. This reminded me a great deal about Holden because Holden doesn't really know who he is himself.

Nikita R 2 said...

‘’ Inexcusable’’ by Chris Lynch was a very confusing piece to read. At first I thought I was reading the pages in the wrong order. I agree with Jennifer M. when she said the author can write just about anything that they want and the reader will believe what they write. If the author has a strong opinion about something they can practically maker you have the same opinion because of the way they use certain words when they write. Holden is the type of character that you really don't know what to think about him. At first you have this one opinion, and then later on you have a completely different opinion. Holden wants to be like the ducks, the can leave whenever they want to. Holden just wants to escape all of the phonies, although he seems to be one himself.

Cristina V 2 said...

Holden as with many other people his age are trying to find out who they are and their place in the world. I think the suitcases symbolize that Holden is running away from something or trying to find who he is. I think the reason why he is so interested in where the ducks go is because he wants to find a way out of this world of phonies too. Holden is not crazy he is just confused and simply wants to find his place in the world just like the rest of us.

Also, the boy in Inexcusable doesn’t classify himself as either a football player or a soccer player. He, just like Holden is also trying to figure out who he is.

Holden is a very confusing character, my view and opinion of him changes numerous times throughout the story. At the beginning of the book I didn’t like him at all (though I am not sure why) then there are times when I feel sorry for him, times when I like him and other times when I just don’t have an opinion about him at all. However, I did think it was sweet of him to but the record for Phoebe and sit and spend time with her. I really didn’t think he would be the type of person who would spend time and talk with their little sister. This surprised me.

Holden’s opinion about sex has come up often throughout the book and came up again on page 173 of Catcher in the Rye. Holden thinks the words to the Robert Burns poem is “If a body catch a body coming through the rye” when really it is “If a body meet a body coming through the rye.” Holden tells Phoebe he wants to be the person who catches the children before they fall off the cliff, and save them from adulthood. The lyrics, “When a body meet a body coming through the rye,” talk about two people sexually attracted to one another meet in the middle of a rye field, and Holden who still doesn’t completely understand the entire concept of sex wants to save children before they fall.

Savannah W 2 said...

I think Holden is searching for a place where he fits in and he's able to feel comfortable about himself because he says he's not phony and he never will be but when he gets around other people he feels the need to say he's somebody else or act like something he's not. I can't get over the fact that on page 147 he states" Maybe I should go to china. My sex life is lousy." he doesn't have a sex life and that's an example of him acting like he's something he's not to fit in. Most of the time I think he's crazy, well actually I think he's crazy the whole time but at the same time he could just be really badly misunderstood.

In Chris Lynch's Inexcusable, the story is told in first person, which views everything from that persons point of view. This boy Keir is trying to figure out who he is, just like Holden. They also have a hard time being judged and they both want great things to be said about them but in reality( which they seem to have problems getting in touch with it) nobody is perfect and everybody has flaws and it's all part of being comfortable with yourself and being able to take responsibility for the choices they make.

Victoria P. 4 said...

I think that Holden is searching for two things in his life. One is to belong and finally feel secure with himself and others. For instance, liking himself and what he is doing in his life. I also think Holden is searching for real people. He is always bringing up phonies and how they are all the same and you rarely hear him speak of real people like his sister or Allie. I think that Holden is always having a rough time finding people he truly likes. He is always running away from his problems, also. He switches from schools to schools and never has anything he really succeeds in. Like many others have said, I also feel the ducks represent Holden and running away or going to another place. He seems to be escaping his problems until one day they will finally catch up to him. In Inexcusable by Chris Lynch, the boy seems to be in the same situation as Holden. He is trying to find himself and really does not understand his whole life and what to do with it. The way it is written also reminds me of The Catcher and the Rye. The boy in Inexcusable also has the same attitude as Holden. An attitude of ignorance and the feeling that he isn’t doing anything wrong when inside he most likely knows what he does is not always the right way for things.

Belinda L 4 said...

Holden seems to be searching for his identity and a place where he feels comfortable being himself, like many of you have mentioned before. I also think Holden is searching for acceptance from people like him. Since he has not found it, it seems like he is trying to fake acceptance. Like the hat. He is not like his family because of his hair color, but he wants to be accepted like them, so he buys the red hat. Im not sure if this is right, it is just a guess, becaue i am sure there are other evidence that could probably prove me wrong.

Keir Sarafian, the main character in "Inexcuable" by Chris Lynch, seems to define himself as a "good guy." For example, he shows us that he could not have possible done anything to the scupture from Gigi because of the things people would describe him as, and also he has always been a gentleman when they were together. He is also a soccer player that respects and his nice to them, unlike all the other football players, which he is also one of. The tape seems to convince him a lot about him not being a bad guy. "one of the few true things that useless tape did show was that I was not one of those pissing football players." He even ate broccoli. He also mentioned multiple times that his is "sick." What does he mean by that?

Jillann C 2 said...

In my opinion, Holden is searching for someone or something to direct him in life. For instance, looking into the subject of coming-of-age, Holden is confused if he should stay and still act like a child or start acting more mature so that he’d be an adult. Judging from what we’ve read in previous chapters of the book, Holden seems to be lingering between those two steps in life; he’s not a child anymore, but he’s also not an adult. I think many of us can relate to Holden on this subject one way or another because since many of us are around Holden’s age, from my personal thought, I feel like Holden in some situations because I don’t want to be treated like a child and have everyone do everything for my, but I also don’t want to be pulled all the way up to an adult where I’d have too much responsibility. A coming-of-age does occur in numerous books, but it also occurs in life at times too.

As it stands now, in my opinion, Holden is not forming a healthy identity. Considering the fact that he is basically wondering around New York because he doesn’t want to face his parents, that says to me that Holden lacks a sense of maturity since he can’t face his problems and go home to explain himself. Since Holden is also always criticizing others’ flaws and judging them, that shows that Holden is creating an identity of being judgmental and by doing that, many people would take that as being a major turn-off for being a friend. From my intake of the book, Holden shows his identity of being a judgmental immature person since he cannot tell his parents that he was expelled from another school and judges basically everyone in sight.

The first thing I noticed in the story Inexcusable was that this story and the Catcher in the Rye were both written in first person. Plus throughout the story I also noticed the fact that the book and the reading had the speaker talk as if they were always right and everyone else was wrong. I noticed that both speakers described themselves as being nice and attractive too, which made me realize that Holden and Keir were conceited in their story. I can definitely see how Mr. Walsh wanted us to read the story and compare the speaker and the book to Holden and The Catcher in the Rye.

casey w. 4 said...

Throughout the story Catcher in the Rye I felt like Holden was a negative person. I thought he was a failure and didn’t care about bringing his life to the next step. Then on pg.173 when Holden is talking to Phoebe he says “and I am standing on the edge of some crazy cliff. What I have to do, I have to catch everybody if they start to go over the cliff.” I feel like Holden thinks he has already been over the cliff and he doesn’t want any one else to fall like he has. Holden is lonely and has moved around school to school three times. He doesn’t seem to be having a stable a life. When Holden said this, my perspective about him changed I saw a more sympathetic character then judgmental and fake. Don’t get me wrong Holden is still judgmental but he seems more mature in the sense that he wants to help others so they don’t hit the point where he is at right now. Holden is in search for people he is comfortable with such as his family as I think Victoria already mentions. Not only does Holden want to prevent others from falling off the cliff but he wants himself to get back on track as well. He is searching for stability, and where he can fit in this world.
In the book Inexcusable by Chris Lynch I feel like the main character Keir Sarafian reminds me of what I thought about Holden in the beginning of the book. “Who was doing the filming? I couldn’t remember. Whoever it was they sucked” When this is said I feel the negativity I felt with Holden when he tried explaining anything about the past. Holden isn’t perfect and in beginning of the book I wasn’t to fond of his character, but anyone who is willing to use the mistakes they made to help others from not doing the same thing they did is great person in my eyes.

Jonathan C. 4 said...

Holden is trying to search for home, but not just that. He wants that home to be somewhere safe that will protect him from everything, if only it were that simple. In that home he wants people who will understand him, people who he considers as real. This ties along with his great relationship with his younger sister and past brother Allie. He views himself as a child trapped in an older body, which is probably what got him started on the whole phony thing. He thought of himself as a phony because he did not see himself as a real person because of his appearance and how he actually feels. The cheap prostitute that he got at the hotel helped me come to my results about Holden wanting more than just someplace to protect him. Losing his virginity is like taking a leap from childhood into adulthood, or him finally feeling his age. It is apparent that Holden is afraid to take that jump because he only wants to talk to the prostitute instead of do what she is paid to do. Holden’s search is defiantly a positive thing in his life. By constantly being faced by these does that he must open, but keeping them closed, he knows what he has to do to accomplish his goals. Better yet, he gets a better understanding of himself by the things that he cannot do. His experiences are valuable even if he is unable to see it now. In Inexcusable, the main character is seen as a good person. Holden on the other hand seems to be the complete opposite. The only thing that seems the same between the two is the fact that they both defend themselves in a losing fight. Inexcusable is written in first person, just like The Catcher in the Rye. By doing this, writers allow readers the ability to feel what they feel and think what they think. Also, it takes readers a step into someone else’s mind. The authors do this so that people can literally step into someone else’s shoes and see everything in a whole new light.

nashally t 2 said...

This book keeps giving me different opinions about Holden. One minute i think he's insane. The next he seems so..innocent. But I guess thats what the author was trying to get the reader to do. But anyways, Holden seems to be searching for..some kind of freedom from the world. Just..some space so he can grow up or just be who he wants to be. Hes probably searching for himself too. He doesnt seem to be very sure about life. He has a mind that can be explored in so many different ways yet..he doesnt put it out there to be discovered. He needs a lot of answers to many questions in his mind. He needs to begin to realized that he cant remain a child for the rest of his life. One way or the other he's going to grow up and needs to start being more responsible with his life and have a set plan on what hes going to do. What he's searching for cant exactly be found if he cant just.. realize that life isnt all fun and games. It's about maturing and becoming an independant person. As of now he isnt. He depends on other people to keep him entertained or keep him busy. And yes I do think he's crazy. Maybe not all the time but he's just very confusing. One minute he admits hes a "madman" next minute he says he certainly is not. He's always contradictiong his own opinion about himself and others. Gets me thinking that he's crazy in some way.

The main character in "Inexcusable" reminds me of Holden in a way. How Holden hates just about everything, it seems like Keir hates everything as well and is opinionated like him too. Keir seems to believe that when he does things its not the way it looks. He was only trying to get Gigi to stop screaming, but made it out to look like he was trying to do something worse. But even still he does it and says "the way it looks is not the way it is." He has another opinion on that then a lot of others do. Holden seems to do the same because Holden always says how much he hates something and does it just for the sake of doing it. I dont know what age Keir is, but if he's any age around Holden, he probably doesnt understand life and also doesnt want to grow up.

Mr. Walsh said...

Nice job picking up on how Keir and Holden both view the world as wrong and they themselves as right. I think there are differences to the extent they are arrogant (I might be at a disadvantage having read all of Inexcusable).

Savannah, good job bringing up his conversation with Luce, which we just skipped over. We also skipped over Sally Hayes. I really think these sections are linked together for a reason.

Keep up referring to one another.

Kellie L 4 said...

Throughout the book, Holden keeps feeling out of place and lonely. I think that Holden is searching for his identity and a place in society. Holden seems like he can’t relate to anyone, not even his family because of his hair color and they are all smart except for him. Also, his friends are either jerks, too smart, or slobs. One factor that makes us not see how Holden relates to them is that the book is in the first person, so we are only seeing things in Holden’s point of view. Also, I agree with Cristina when she said that Holden was so interested in the ducks because he wanted to find a way to get away from all of the phonies. In “Inexcusable”, the story was written in first person as well, which gave us limited information just like Holden. The boy in “Inexcusable reminded me of Holden because they both didn’t know where they belonged. The boy was on the soccer team and the football team and he didn’t know where he belonged. Holden can relate to this because he is between childhood and adulthood which is shown by the pond that was freezing over. Half was frozen which represented his maturity and half was not which represented his immaturity. Overall, I think that both characters are trying to find out what their identity is and where they belong in society.

Mr. Walsh said...

One general point that many of you are glossing over:

What is the big difference between Holden's denial of who he is and Keir's?

Jess L 2 said...

Holden is searching for individuality and where he belongs. He always seems to say or think something that leads us to believe that he hates all of mankind, more or less, but I dont think he really hates anyone. I think he is just pointing out their "phonyness" because he is trying to convince himself that he is different from all of them, that they are phony and he is genuine. He thinks all adults are fakes, and only children are innocent and pure. I think that this is a bad way to think, because he can't stay a kid forever, no matter how much he dreads growing up. Eventually, he will realize that he can't survive in the world today without being responsible and maturing, and then he will see how foolish he is being right now. I'm not saying that is wrong of him to want a perfect world, but I am saying that it is foolish to actually believe that it is possible.

The story Inexcusable has many similarities to The Catcher in the Rye, I think. Both stories are told in 1st person, and we can get into the character's thoughts. This really helps the way we percieve the characters. Also, Keir and Holden seem to have a bit in common. They both seem to think that everything they do is justifyable, and neither of them believe that they ever do anything wrong. Also, they both seem to make the story a bit biased. We are only getting their point of view, through their thoughts, which are biased. We never really know if they are telling the truth or not.

Jillian D 2 said...

I agree with Jennifer when she says that at some points she hates Holden and other points she likes him. He is a very hard character to like. I only like him when he is talking about his family. That brings up a question. Is he a very family oriented person? And does he have a different way of showing it? I also agree that he is trying to dig himself out of this hole and is searching for something that he can’t really get a grasp on yet. Holden has had some very traumatic experiences, like losing his brother and getting kicked out of schools. I think that is all I an effect of losing his brother. I see that Phoebe is like the only person he really can relate to. When Holden talks to other people he seems to be interested in what they have to say, but in reality he just calling them some sort of name. He seems to have no luck with his search for his happy median. No one seems to be the person he can talk to at his age level.

I agree with Sandy, I see how when she says Keir seems himself different as to what other people say. I think he isn’t a very bad guy, but he reminds me of Holden when Holden is like, “I’m the biggest sex manic you’ll ever meet.” Keir gives me the same vibe. Like he is saying “I’m the man, everyone loves me” Another connection is about the girl situation with both of them, they both seem to be obsessed with these girls who don’t really “see” them and the affection that Holden and Keir have to them. The point of view stays the same through out the chapters. It’s in the 1st person the whole time.

Mat M. 4 said...

In “Catcher” Holden is searching for purpose in life and even though he doesn’t tell us, he’s always asking himself “where do I belong.” I think he asks himself that because he feels alienated from the world thus he doesn’t belong anywhere yet is constantly searching for somewhere to fit in. I totally agree with Elaine that the ducks symbolize his search for acceptance and that ducks migrate place to place as well. Also I think the suitcases also symbolize his search and self-realization. Suitcases are taken with you so it could show how you’re past (all of your belongings in the suitcase) meets the future. I think it is natural and healthy for Holden to be searching for purpose. Sooner or later I think everyone reaches a point when they ask themselves the same question Holden has been asking himself. In “Inexcusable” by Chris Lynch it seems as if Keir sees himself as a perfect kid like Holden sees himself as flawless as well.

Herman T 2 said...

To start off my blog, Mr. Walsh I think you did a bad job on the pages because it took me a while to figure that the pages were all over the place. – Just a tip. Don’t fail me please. xD and it is differentiate not differeniate.
For example, I think every time Holden asks where the ducks are going to go when winter comes, he is asking where he will go. How is he going to escape the harshness of the world? How is he going to escape the phoniness? He is looking for his safety.-Lynn. I agree with this because when you think about the pond, and how Holden wants to leave it. Holden isn’t really getting nowhere because he left Pencey, a proportion of the cold pond and yet he’s still in the same bitter cold pond because Holden is coming to realize that a world without phonies isn’t possible and he doesn’t feel like giving up his fight to leave the phonies so he is still trying to look for something. That something that Holden is looking for might be himself or a place where he can go to feel comfortable and fit in. Holden realizes that he has nowhere to go because he is no longer welcome in Pencey where he had a shelter now Holden is broke and he’s wandering around New York lost with no where to go until he thinks of Mr. Antolini. Holden is the duck because he moves around constantly, I somehow think that Holden is like a ugly duckling because ducks move together with their mother and Holden is a duckling that has isolated himself and somewhat retains the behaviors of ducklings. Also some people brought up the point of Holden looking for something, and I concur. Why would Holden be walking around in New York when he is near broke? Oh and back to the pond, I was wondering if the pond can mean something else? A pond can melt or crack overtime, so does that symbolize something?
In the 2 chapters of Inexcusable by Chris Lunch, I was reminded of The Cather in the Rye. Both stories tend to move backwards to a certain event. Kier reminds me of Holden in a way, Holden tells us of how he hates phonies just for the sake of it and Kier tells us how nice of a guy he was but he changes. Kier then went on saying “the way it looks is not the way it is.” Kier knows what he is doing but he doesn’t want to accept the fact it was him. He acts as if he has a split personality or he does have one because if he did something he would just blame it on something else. If Kier was to kill someone and he was caught he would’ve said it was he who did it not me. Like the Catcher in the Rye, it is a first person point of view which is biased and limited, so we can’t see what other people think of Kier when he says all of this.
Oh and I think Holden is half crazy because he contradicts himself so often. Half the time Holden seems sane but then he changes abruptly leading us to think he’s insane. Holden is a mysterious person with an altering personality so it is hard to tell if he is insane or not.

will h 4 said...

I think that Holden is searching for somewhere to belong. He thinks that he only belongs with his family. This is because they are the only people besides him who are not phony. He doesn't belong anywhere else yet because he thinks that everybody in the world is phony except him. He can never make a good friend because there is something wrong with everybody he meets. He differeniates himself from others by disliking them after his first impression of them. I agree with jeniffer when she said that Holden is looking for a way out just like the ducks in the pond do in the winter. I think that the ducks symbolize his search for somewhere to belong when big changes happen.

The narrator defines himself as inbetween a football player and a soccer player. He thinks that he is innocent of the "inexcusable" actions that the football players took part in. the narrator changes his point of view by first saying what the football players did to the soccer players was funny, but then saying it was wrong. I think that he is a football player. But he became an honorary soccer player so he doesn't know what side to be on, soccer or football.

Malik B. 4 said...

I agree with Marissa that Holden is looking for friendship or any relationship for that matter. Although his encounters with people aren’t ideal he continues to make plans of the same kind to avoid being alone. I think Holden is afraid to be alone, but accidentally pushes people away by coming off too strong. For example, when Holden went out with Sally he asked her to runaway with him after being around her only a day. When Holden mentions the suitcases again I began thinking of them as something other than social class. As Holden tries to run away he always brings some sort of “baggage”. The suitcases can symbolize a person’s problems. When running away people try to lessen the amount of “baggage” they bring with them or problems. Buying expensive suitcases is the same as disguising problems. Some people disguise their issues well (expensive suitcases) and others not very well (cheap suitcases).
When Holden is talking to Phoebe when he sneaks home, she seemed to be more aware that he needs to figure out what he’s going to do with his life. When Holden responds saying he wants to guide people back away from the edge of the rye I thought it was ironic because to me Holden would be the person that needed to be guided away from the edge. Holden doesn’t have a goal and seems to be living his life day to day. How can someone who doesn’t have a goal help someone else reach theirs?

Andy T. 4 said...

In the Catcher in the Rye, Holden is searching for a place where he belongs. Like Lynn said, Holden relates to the ducks. He wanted to know where the ducks were going because he wanted to know where he was going himself. Holden is confused with his life and he wants to search for a place where there is only children and no adults that’s why he wanted to be the one that caught the body if a body came through the rye. Like we said in class, Holden thinks it is acceptable if a child does something like spit because they don’t know anything and it looks cute and adults can’t because they should know what’s right and wrong. Being in the children world, it is easier for him then being in the adult world taking on these responsibilities.
In Inexcusable, by Chris Lynch, Keir is a football player and a soccer player. He hangs out with both the teams but can’t choose which one he belongs to. He hangs out with the football players but wouldn’t do the things they did like piss on the soccer player’s clothes because he was one of the soccer players himself. Keir relates to Holden because he doesn’t know who he is just like Holden who can’t figure out who he is and where he belongs.

Kim C 2 said...

As many have said, Holden is searching for his identity or “existence.” Holden has gray hair and his family has red hair, he feels excluded and he wants to find something to be part of. Both Allie and Phoebe are considered smart yet Holden is an unsuccessful student. Holden doesn’t really share similarities with anybody, which so he feels different from people and he wants to find the part of his identity that he will fit into.

I used to just think Holden was stubborn when Maurice asked for five dollars and Holden just stood hard on his side and didn’t give the five dollars until he got beat up. Though, Holden’s dream is crazy. When Holden was with Sally the other day, he expressed to her that his wanted to live in a cabin far away from the world of phonies. Then when Holden sees Phoebe, he says that he wants to be the “catcher in the rye.” Phoebe was just silent and got off the subject.

In the novel Inexcusable by Chris Lynch, the point of view is first person, same point of view as The Catcher in the Rye. The point of view is biased because its first person and the information are unreliable just like Holden speaking his story out. Also, because the whole book hasn’t been read, there may be more evidence about Keir.

henry d:2 said...

Even though this is off topic I truly wonder in the book if the world is phony? The book being in 1st person show’s it’s biased and Holden seems to be a troubled and unreliable narrator, he failed 4 schools and we learned that he has been hospitalized for a while. Holden also seems to make hasty judgments showing his perception about people wither it is true or false. Could it be that his perception of people is phony, not the people themselves? After finishing the chapters we were suppose to read we learn about Mr. Antolini petting Holden on his head showing his affection and concern, yet Holden describes it as a sexual assault. It’s shown that he has conclude a hasty judgment and clearly doesn’t think of anything else by barging out of the home. This may be a point where he questions the way he acts, just like the scene about the nuns. Holden picturing the world as black and white by making children innocent and adults as cold unsympathetic characters, yet Phoebe is clearly more mature than Holden thinks she is maybe more mature than Holden himself, and how adults can being sympathetic and kind like the nuns. He realizes that his perception of the world was hasty and questionable and this may help him in search of himself, adapting to the world and doing it without going to a extreme like alienation. Herman I disagree when you said “….Holden is looking for might be himself or a place where he can go to feel comfortable and fit in,” thought it seems he is looking for a place, he has found it and is looking for a way to adapt into the world, and he may realize that him himself right now is the wall that blocks him from the world.

::HebaK:: 4 said...

I think that Holden is searching for himself. He wants and needs a destination. Him roaming around New York is just a way he wants to express himself. He wanders around trying to figure out who he is and what he should make of himself. He doesn’t realize he is doing this. Holden just thinks he is wandering around for no reason. He doesn’t understand what he is setting out to do. In the novel, Inexcusable by Chris Lynch, Keir does not understand nor believe in what he happened. Holden and Keir both are denying what has happened to them; (Holden losing Allie, Keirs->Gigi) I also agree with Andy, that Holden is looking for a place he belongs. He feels left out, deprived (maybe?). Holden does not want to admit this, just like Keir and him not believing what had happened.

Mr. Walsh said...

I've picked up on the thread of place. Where is Holden going? Where does he belong? Nice job to those who connected to the ducks.

Herman, thanks for pointing out the confusion over Inexcusable. I tried to explain it in class, but probably didn't do a clear enough job. Thank you for the spell-check. I should take my own advice and type my response in Word first - that is a lesson to you all. :)

Kim, good job addressing Sally albeit briefly. I think this scene informs us on the issue of where Holden may want to go or at least his confusion on what to do now.

We are all over the place on the suitcases. My inclination is to say that we are thinking too much about it or overanalyzing it. A general rule of thumb: Do not put the symbol in a scene it doesn't appear it.

Keep it up!!!

Steven E. 4 said...

What Holden is searching for is acceptance. He is always saying that he is lonely and he doesn’t have many friends. He doesn’t fit in with most people. One reason for that is he thinks almost everyone in the world is a phony. The only person that Holden can really get along with is his sister Phoebe. Even when he’s alone though, he says he still misses his “phony” friends like Stradlater and Ackley. Holden doesn’t want to be like all the phonies in the world so he tries to differentiate himself by wearing his red hunting hat. It makes him stand out. That symbolizes that he wants people to notice him accept him.
His search doesn’t seem to be going very good though. He just does not seem to like most of the people that he meets. The search that he is on is invaluable but the way he is doing it is foolish. He wants to be accepted but is lonely all the time because he judges people too quickly without even getting a chance to get to know them.

Amir Q. 4 said...

Holden is searching for a place where he belongs; he does not like his world for its phoniness. Where did he get the idea of phoniness? Holden may think of himself as not being phony as he absolutely hates it, yet I see him being more and more phony as the book progresses, which makes me believe that he is a hypocrite. I think what Herman said about the ducks as true and that they symbolize his search for a place to escape to cold and harsh reality of the world, and not just its phoniness. So far he has progressed in his search but I don’t think he will find the place that he is looking for, I think he may just have to accept the world as it is and move on. The main character’s point of view in Chris Lynch's “Inexcusable” is very obviously biased and that tells the reader to not always trust what they are being told. Holden himself seems to be very biased as is shown with his view of people and the world.

jimmy v. 2 said...

I'm kind of tired of the suitcase(s) too. I don't get how there could be so much in just suitcases. It's confusing.

About the conversation between Holden and Sally/Luce, I think these two were connected because in both conversations we get a glimpse of Holden's insanity. Holden is crazy I think in a way that it keeps him from maturing yet he wants to grow up. I don't know if that makes sense. It's like he wants to stay a kid and stop other kids from becoming adults but something deeper is maturing him.
In the conversation between Holden & Sally, he flips out on her and asks her to run away with him to get married in some cabin with 10 dollars. Similar but different from this conversation is the one he had with Luce. Holden keeps asking Luce about his sex life and Luce tells him that sex is a spiritual and physical thing, very adult-like. Holden says, ''So do I regard it as a waddayacallit - a physical and spiritual experience and all. I really do. But it depends on who the hell im doing it with. If I'm doing it with somebody I don't even -''(p146) and Luce tells Holden to quiet a little.
What connects these two is that in both situations where Holden goes psychoboy, the subject has something to do with maturity. Sally's convo has to do with living on their own and getting married while Luce's convo was about sex being a purely epic adult event. This burst of excitement is the ''something deeper maturing him''. ALSO his partly gray hair, height, smoking/drinking and sex talk habits show that he is helplessly craving for adulthood.
But the passage Mr.Walsh talked about today in classs about being a catcher in the rye reveals the opposite. He has control over this and he wants to prevent himself/kids from becoming adults. Probably from fear of being phony.

His craziness is from the pent up adult-Holden trying to breaking free. This is probably what gets him into the mental insitution.


I previewed this post and it was massive. Oh well. I'm probably the last poster anyway. To summarize, Holden is only crazy when it comes to mature things.

DAvid T 2 said...

Holden is someone who thinks that the adult world is made up with phonies and that he is the one person who can save the children from the adult world because he isn’t a phony.
The passage that we went over in class showed us that Holden didn’t want to think about two children running at each other through the rye and then “touching” when they meet. Through Holden’s eyes, that would mean that the children are coming into the world of adulthood through sex. Holden wants to be the one that stops the children from having sex and entering the world filled with phony adults.
I agree with what Herman said about how the ducks symbolize Holden’s desire to escape the world.
I also agree with Jimmy that every time there is a scene that involves maturing, Holden’s crazy side pops out. Holden’s grey hair is supposed to symbolize his constant struggle to let everyone know that he is mature, yet he is afraid to grow up and become an adult. I think that Holden is searching for a way to become mature, but to not become an adult at the same time.
In Inexcusable by Chris Lynch, Kier is being yelled at by Gigi. Kier keeps denying that it wasn’t his fault that the statue broke, just like how Holden is denying the fact that people will have to become an adult sooner or later. They both can’t accept what’s happening and when one incident concerning adulthood or jeopardizes Kier’s “good student” record, they both get a little crazy.

Herman T 2 said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Aaron G 2 said...

I believe Holden is searching for what he wants to do with his life. Although the obvious part when Holden talks about what he wants to do with his life; Holden is always getting kicked out of school to show he is not sure what he want to do with his life. This makes a lot of sense on what he wants to do the only thing wrong is he should try harder in school to expand his options.
I disagree with Kim c and think Catcher In the Rye is second person. Yet I defiantly agree with Hebak when they say “Holden and Keir both are denying what has happened to them; (Holden losing Allie, Keirs->Gigi)” This is an excellent point and if I could would say the exact same thing.